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Clips not stopping at right time in Presentation Mode


Guest b00merang
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I've been experiencing a problem with how clip segments are ending. I've edited the clips to stop at a certain point but when playing in Presentation Mode they are stopping too early, so I'm missing the last words of testimony. I've heard from other trial techs that this problem is happening to them, too. Does anyone have a solution for it?

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  • Technical Support Engineer

This is an issue with Windows 8/10 and MPEG 1, and MPEG 2 video files.

 

In TrialDirector Transcript Manager, verify that the Audio / Video parts are definitely MPEG-1 or MPEG-2. Right click on them and verify file extension under properties. If they are, we need to convert them to MP4 (MPEG-4). They can try to convert it using this program:

 

http://www2.indatacorp.com/apps/UTILITIES/MPEG4_TRANSCODER.exe

 

Not all MPEG’s are built the same. Our transcoder may or may not work. Either way, youwill need to encode to a compliant H.264 MP4 file using our software or 3rd party. Once you have that – we can move to step 2.

 

Make a Clip Creation Script in Transcript Manager via Clips > Export Clip Creation Script. We want to backup all of your clip cutting work.

In Transcript Manger, go to Tools > TimeCoder. This will launch the built-in version of TimeCoder. You need to locate their original CMS file for the problematic deposition.

 

In TimeCoder, go to File > Import from > TrialDirector CMS. Browse to the original CMS and follow the menus.

The Transcript should now show in TimeCoder. Now go to Multimedia > Multimedia Manager.You will see all of your videos listed in this screen.

 

Click the first of the videos and then the REPLACE button. Choose it’s replacement MP4 file that was converted back in step 1. The idea here is to REPLACE / swap all those bad MPEG 1 or 2 files with their good MP4 counterparts. Press OK.

 

 

Now that we have these switched to MP4 - In TimeCoder, go to File > Export to TrialDirector CMS. Save that CMS file in it’s own folder. Don’t save it with other CMS files because CMS files might append other CMS files they are saved with. We want to avoid that.

In TrialDirector, go back to Transcript Manager. Make sure you made a Clip Creation Script back in Step 2. Right click on the problem deposition and delete it.

 

Go to Transcripts > Import Transcripts From > Synchronized Transcripts. Browse out to that CMS file you saved in Step 5. We assume the video is already on the computer so let's choose "Do Not Copy" when asked about the multimedia. Follow the rest of the menus and import it.

So now we have the MP4 version of the problem deposition loaded but where are our clips?

 

Find that CCS file you saved back in Step 2. Go to View By > Clips. Then go to Clips > Execute Clip Creation Script. Point it to the CCS file and that should give us our clips back. Test the clips in Presentation Mode and they should not cutoff anymore.

 

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Wow, this is not good and is an ENORMOUS issue -- probably the biggest one I've seen since I started using TD back about 20 some years ago.

 

One of my main reasons for upgrading to new laptops, TD 6 and Windows 10 was because I was assured it would all work "just fine". In particular I noted my concerns about MPEG support and was told TD6 would essentially work in a sandbox and not rely on whatever codecs were required as in TD5 and earlier versions. I figured this would justify what I believe is now about a $1000+/yearly maintenance fee.

 

Currently I have 51 deponents and each have about 5 videos each. That works out to about 255 videos that need to be re-encoded to MP4. Using my new laptop, that is taking approximately 30 minutes per video. So 5 days from now, running 24 hours a day, and after going through the involved CMS/MPEG replacement method above, the solution "may or may not work".

 

 

 

 

 

 

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UPDATE

 

I did download the Indata MPEG->MP4 converter. It is basically a front end to a DOS-based FFMPEG call. It just simply failed when trying to convert the MPEGs to MP4 format, and none of the resulting MP4s were even playable.

 

I was able to convert to MP4 using Adobe Media Encoder. With only a very small test case so far they seem to be working.

 

What is arguably even more annoying is that OnCue does succesfully play all my original clipped MPEGs (the ones that TD6 will not) in presentation mode, so it seems questionable to me that the blame for this being placed on Microsoft/Windows MPEG support (or lack of).

 

 

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  • 4 weeks later...
  • Escalation Engineer

The recent TrialDirector Update is a patch for a Windows Update coming this Spring, and contained no bug fixes or feature enhancements. It is just designed to be compatible with Windows Operating Systems after this update. This does not mean that we aren't working on improving TrialDirector, just that we wanted to get a quick patch out to prevent issues with Windows 10 and Trial Director in the coming months.

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I am a long time user and defender of TD generally, and TD6 since its release. You are about lose me as customer. First, to be clear, this has not always been an issue with Windows 10-- if it is indeed an issue with Windows 10 at all. I had no problems until a month or so ago. I worked with tech support, and converted to MP4, replaced them in TimeCoder, and got the same unpredictable presentation playback. I ended up having to create my clips in Premiere. This is a huge flaw that is going to force me to go to OnCue, despite, in my view, OnCue being essentially an open beta. At least the clips I make are what is presented. iPro, time stop talking about the next big thing, this problem is THE BIG THING, and it needs to be fixed immediately.

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  • 4 weeks later...

I had this same issue on Win 10 during a trial and it was not good - very unhappy client! I spent some time on the phone with an ipro tech and we tried a few different options, including the codec pack. Ultimately, the fix was converting my mpg files to mp4 and replacing them in TimeCoder's media manager and then re-exporting the .cms file. From there I exported the .ccs file of my already-created clips from TD and then removed that transcript from the case file. I then re-imported using the new .cms which referenced the new mp4 and then executed the .ccs file to bring my clips back in. This seemed to fix my issue and I have not had any issues since (knock on wood!)

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  • Escalation Engineer
I had this same issue on Win 10 during a trial and it was not good - very unhappy client! I spent some time on the phone with an ipro tech and we tried a few different options, including the codec pack. Ultimately, the fix was converting my mpg files to mp4 and replacing them in TimeCoder's media manager and then re-exporting the .cms file. From there I exported the .ccs file of my already-created clips from TD and then removed that transcript from the case file. I then re-imported using the new .cms which referenced the new mp4 and then executed the .ccs file to bring my clips back in. This seemed to fix my issue and I have not had any issues since (knock on wood!)

 

 

Patrick, thanks for posting to the Ipro Community. To address your question, Microsoft began scaling back MPEG-1 and MPEG-2 support back in 2012 when Windows 8 was released. We've been advising our users to gradually move to MPEG-4 (MP4) video as this handles better on newer OS'es such as Windows 10. If you've applied any of the previous Creator's updates or the April 2018 update from Microsoft, you will definitely need to be using MP4 for all videos and all depositions. We would suggest migrating all your future depos and video to MP4 or equivalent.

 

See here for our community post on this topic last year.

 

 

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